Wrestlecrap: I guess first of all, what are you up to these days?
O: Well right now, I’m on 74 different radio stations doing pretty much the same rap schtik I did when I was in the WWF. I’m also still actively involved in the WWF in several areas, and there’s a new wrestling federation that’s trying to compete called the Urban Wrestling Federation, they just offered me a deal. What that is is a big time agency in New York and an entertainment agency out of New Jersey have gotten together to put up millions of dollars and they want to fuse wrestling and hip hop in a real big way. So being that I was one of the innovators – not PN News, for the record (laughs), that I was one of the innovators of putting rap and wrestling together, they are seeking my expertise in several ways. So we’re going to see how serious they are, see how serious it is, and look at that. I mean, if it’s an independent with some guys with wrestlers, a microphone, and a camcorder, obviously not (laughs). But these guys seem to have their act together. They want to put some money behind it and get a major network deal behind it, so we’ll see where it goes.
WC:So they are more or less targeting the black community?
O: Well, yeah…Smackdown is garnering the largest populous or demographic of black people that watch wrestling, so they ‘re really targetting that audience. What they want to do is integrate a lot of the well known hip hop artists into the program to garner that market further.
WC: So kinda like how Vince has done stuff with the rock & roll, but you guys are taking a different slant on it, going with urban music then.
O: Exactly.
WC: That’s very interesting. I wish you the best of luck with it. Any idea what kind of time frame they are looking at to get on a network?
O: Actually, late fall. They’ve been working at it a long time, and they are in the final process of signing a network deal and signing contracts with acts and negotiating with perspective agents and management.
WC: So I understand where they would get the hip hop artists from, but where would they get the wrestlers from? Independents or…
O: I really couldn’t tell you. Some independents, but if these guys are going to be major players like they hope to be, they are probably going to go after some of the better works that aren’t working now or aren’t active now. There’s a pretty big talent pool out there, so they shouldn’t have any problem finding top quality talent.
WC: And with WCW dropping people to lower their payroll, they could get people from there, I suppose.
O: Well, WCW will have a bunch of no name acts they don’t hardly have to pay anything. I guess that’s a good business strategy, but I look at WCW these days and I know nobody there. I’ve been in the business since ’93, so me knowing people personally is one thing, but I haven’t even heard of these people being a fan of the business. So I don’t know what they are doing over there.
WC: Well, that makes two of us. You said you were in the business in 93. Did you start out with the WWF?
O: Yeah, I started out with the WWF.
WC: How did that come about?
O: I was in Las Vegas just on a weekend vacation. I was at a craps table, right before Wrestlemania 9. And I saw Randy Savage walking through a casino, and I just went up and started rapping to him. Vince was there, and they were blown away by what I did. Vince told me to call him at WWF headquarters that Monday. I’m thinking, “Call Vince McMahon at WWF headquarters? Yeah right.” That’s like the President saying, “Call me at the White House.” So I called his office, and sure enough, we talked for about an hour. He called me a few weeks after Wrestlemania 9, and said he had two guys I would fit right in with, and we want to do a deal with you.
WC: So you had always been a wrestling fan?
O: Always been a wrestling fan, for sure.
WC: Where did you grow up?
O: I grew up in Brooklyn, New York.
WC: So you were a WWF fan?
O: Yeah, but I would go down south every year, down in Georgia. And down there, the old NWA would come on all day long. I was a fan of Hulk Hogan when he first started, but Ric Flair was one of my favorites. He was the man. And WWF would come on channel 9 in New York and we would watch it with my father every Saturday at midnight. Bob Backlund, Bruno Sammartino. I was a big fan. And then I woke up one day in 1993 and I was sitting in a room in a meeting with Bob Backlund because now I was working with him. It was phenomenal.
WC: So you had not met Mo and Mabel before?
O: I’d never heard of them.
WC: I believe they came out of Memphis?
O: They came out of Memphis, the USWA. They were a group called the Harlem Nights. They came out of there. Before then, I knew nothing about the USWA, I knew nothing about them. I’d never heard of them.
WC: When you guys met, did you get along? Did it click?
O: Actually, it was a rocky road in the beginning. It was a rocky road for quite some time, because by this time, I had an aristocratic mentality. I had been out in Hollywood, out in California. Now before I had got to the WWF, I had been doing big things. I had been hanging out with Frank Sinatra and Tony Bennett. I was doing this, that and the other, and I was used to … it’s a long story, but the crux of the story is that I was used to fine dining, and they were used to eating at a truck stop. I was used to staying at the Marriot, and they were used to staying at the Motel 6. We had an east coast vs. southern mind set clashing in one car going up and down the road. So we conflicted for a long time, but after a while, we really bonded and I really got a love for those guys today. But it was a stormy road, but we got it together after a while.
WC: What were you doing before you came to the WWF?
O: I was in the recording business, not recording, but doing rap for people who didn’t like rap. I would play Vegas, I would play Caesar’s Palace or Bally’s. I was doing a lot of big things with big names for people out in Hollywood. I had management that got me hooked up with a lot of big names in situations where I would make a lot of money. I made a lot of money back then.
WC: Not to pry, but what was better financially – working that way or working with the WWF?
O: Working with the WWF was better financially because it was more stable. It was more of a constant.
WC: You said you and Mo and Mabel got tight after a spell – do you still talk to those guys?
O: Yeah, I actually do. In fact, if I do go to the Urban Wrestling Federation, I will more than likely be going in with Mo. I don’t know about Mabel, because I don’t know if the Viscera gimmick is going to keep going in the WWF or whatever. I’m not sure, but I’m pretty sure we could get him on board to, but that’s a big if. I really got to explore what that package is going to be.
WC: As you said, Mabel is now Viscera in the WWF. What’s Mo up to these days?
O: He’s still real active in the independents. He’s done real well for himself as far as wrestling goes. He had his own wrestling organization going down in Tennessee and he had it going for a couple of years, it was on TV and everything. It was called Southern Extreme Wrestling. And he ran it. He was paid a lot of dollars for being in the WWF, and he ran his own wrestling organization pretty good. That fizzled out, these things happen. But the guy is down in Memphis and he’s wrestling for an organization down there, and they have TV every week. He’s stayed active in southern independents, and he’s done quite well for himself in that arena. Despite what you guys say or think, those two guys are good workers, and they really put their heart and soul into it.
WC: Hey, we don’t bust on anybody, man! (laughs)
O: Oh come on, you guys, you guys, you guys! (laughs)
WC: It should be an honor for you! (laughs)
O: Now wait a minute, let me quote you: “They were bad workers with their rapping fool of a manager, Oscar.” ‘Fool’ in big yellow letters! Fool, F-O-O-L! That’s what you said about me!
WC: You know, I never thought I would have any one quote that stuff back to me! (laughs)
O: I bet!
WC: My face is so red. (laughs)
O: Yeah, I imagine. I couldn’t wait to give you a call! (laughs) When I get to heaven and I see Merle, I’m going to have a conversation with him too!
WC: So aside from being listed on WrestleCrap, which would have to be your highlight, what would be the favorite moment thus far of your wrestling career?
O: My favorite moment of my wrestling career is Wrestlemania X. That question is so easy to answer. I would have to say the whole experience. Before I got into that, my whole dream was to be a rap artist. I used to see Run DMC and everybody back then, and I’d see them on these big tour busses going to arenas. And I finally got to do it, but I got to do it in a different way, you know. And I got to go all over the world with the WWF. But Wrestlemania X would have to be the highlight of my career because it was at Madison Square Garden, where I used to go to as a kid watching wrestling. And walking down that aisle with 20,000 people vibing to what I was doing that day, that really touched me. And I looked out into the crowd at the exact nosebleed seat to see where I had come from and where I had came at that pivotal moment of my life…that’s something I will never forget. And because of that, no matter what went on there that I liked or I didn’t like, I have no bitter feelings towards the organization. I’ve watched the WWF for years, and like I said, I am still actively involved in different areas of the company, I still do things for them. But that changed my life. It gave me a sense of stardom, it gave me money, it gave me a whole lot of things. It led to things I am doing today. But to answer your question, Wrestlemania X is my highlight moment of being in the WWF.
WC: You travelled all over the world with the WWF. What are some of the more exotice places you went and what kind of reactions did you get from places that may not have been familiar with that type of music?
O: People in Germany knew how to go “Hi, Ho”, stick their hands in the air, and yell “Whoomp, there it is” when I told them to say it. That was one thing that used to have me tripping out. No matter where I went or what language it was, when I came out they knew what to do, they knew what to say. Israel, the same way. I got to go to Israel, when I went to Israel, the four cities we went to there, it was the same thing. I always got a good reception. The hotel that I stayed at was on the Sea of Gallillee. Bret Hart and I went to Jerusalem, did the whole tour of where Jesus was. We went and floated in the Dead Sea together. It was phenomenal. Israel would have to be one of the more exotic places I went to that sticks out in my mind and my heart, for that matter. I’m mad because we went to Hawaii for the first time, but we had a double shot that day, so we had to leave that day. I didn’t get to go to the other side of the island and stay at no big resort like I had dreamed of doing. I got to go everywhere, so I can’t complain.
WC: You said you had gone to Jerusalem with Bret Hart. Who else did you like to hang our with then?
O: When we were overseas, we all hung out together – we’d never leave each other’s sides, aside from going to our hotel rooms and going to sleep. That was always a good thing. Probably my best friends were Bret Hart, Owen Hart, God rest his soul, the Harts were really good to me. The Steiner Brothers back then. Vince was an incredible help to me the whole way. He really nurtured me when I was down there, because he knew I was new to the business. Who else…The Samoans. You know, everybody was real supportive. Everybody appreciated what I did. We were basically all good friends.
WC: You wrote all the raps, right?
O: Yes.
WC: Was there ever anything….I can just see Vince or Pat Patterson coming up with suggestions , like “we want you to rap about WWF Ice Cream Bars.” Did they ever come up with anything that you were like, “we can’t rap about that.”
O: No, because I could basically rap about anything, so there was nothing they came up with that I was, “well, that’s kind of out there.”
WC: Did they just kind of give you free reign?
O: Yeah. Vince would come up to me and he’d say, “All right, rap about Houston because we’re in Houston, Texas.” Then he would try to rap a little bit, “Come on, Houston!” And I would be, “All right, Vince, I got it.”
WC: (laughs) I would give anything to see Vince McMahon rap!
O: Oh Vince really thought he was hip! He thought he could dance, he thought he could sing. He thought he was a performer. He’s the man.
WC: Over the years, the WWF has put out a lot of music albums, and when you were around, they put out one called Wrestlemania: The Album, which is actually up on the site right now as people are listening to or reading this. Were you disappointed that you never got to get into that arena? Was there ever any talk of you guys putting out your own CD?
O: Yeah, that was supposed to happen, but a lot of things that were supposed to take off didn’t. So yeah, that was a disappointment. That’s a good question.
WC: Have you ever heard Wrestlemania: The Album?
O: Yeah, but I want to say about that album that it was done before I got there. I am pretty sure that had I been there before it was done, I would have been on it, since I was the best performer, not as far as working in the ring, but as far as entrance, as far as music, at that particular time. It sure wasn’t Jeff Jarrett! (laughs)
WC: You know, if people listen to the samples we have posted of that on the site, I am sure you won’t have a single person disagree that you were a better singer than Bret Hart. (laughs) He’s a great worker, but keep him away from the music scene.
O: Well, everybody can’t be everything.
WC: Let’s flip that a little bit. Did you ever think about becoming a wrestler yourself?
O: I gave it a fleeting thought. But when I almost broke my ribs, that thought went way out the window.
WC: How did that come about?
O: I took a few bumps, as everybody does. I got tackled by Jeff Jarrett really hard, and I fell the wrong way, I fell right on my side. I thought I cracked something.
WC: Eventually they decided to turn Men on a Mission heel, and Mabel splashed you. When they did that, did they just say “that’s it, there’s nothing else we can do with you?”
O: That was my choice. When they turned the team heel, that’s when I decided I wanted to get out. When I started, I told them everything I did I wanted to be positive. And when they turned the team heel, I didn’t want any part of that at all. That’s the reason why I left.
WC: Um…ok. You didn’t want to be with anybody else? There was no talk of putting you with someone else?
O: No. JJ Dillon said, “The Undertaker is with Paul Bearer, and you’re with them.” And that’s basically the way they wanted to keep it.
WC: Eventually Mabel just kind of wound up on his own anyway. I don’t remember exactly how that happened. I think maybe Mo got hurt.
O: Right. Mabel hung around a little longer. He was at an advantage because of his phenomenal size, and because of his quality of work. I mean, he was really agile for someone that big.
WC: When you first saw them, what went through your mind? The first time Vince said, “here are the guys you’ll be working with.” What what through your mind, because Mabel, I’ve met him, and he is huge.
O: Well, the first time I saw them was at Stamford for a meeting, and I came down from the hotel and the car came up. But he was sitting in the car, and I didn’t know how big he really was until he got out of the car. And when he got out of the car, I was like, “WOW!” The first time I saw them wrestle, I was blown away. They worked well together, the way Mabel moved. I couldn’t believe it. I knew it was going to be a really good thing.
WC: I want to thank you again for doing the interview with us, and no hard feelings about what we wrote about you, I’m sure.
O: Well, I want to thank you for having me on there. I like the site, I go to it all the time.